Minutes from the Neighborhood “Listening Session” for the West TSA
October 22, 2009
This was a meeting intended to hear what neighbors to Open Space had to say to their “Neighborhood Representatives” of the Community Collaborative Group. Although the meeting was designed primarily to get input on what topics were of concern to neighbors as it pertains to Open Space near their homes, there were a few other issues that needed to be aired before that could happen.
Here are the minutes from that meeting:
Introduction
Joe Mantione, Environmental Planner from the OSMP introduced the concept of the West Trail Study Area and what the Community Collaborative Group was conceived to do. He also introduced the representatives who were elected through a caucus format. He fielded questions about the process of selecting the representatives at the September 15th caucus meeting.
There were several people in attendance who expressed strong concerns that the caucus process that evening was flawed and that the neighborhood representatives selected in that process do not representative them. The focus of their concern was that the resulting neighborhood representatives had too much “recreation” perspective. They were specifically targeting the reps that had affiliations with mountain biking organizations in the past.
There were several other participants at the meeting that voiced the following concerns (paraphrased here):
Why should we believe that OSMP is going to listen to the concerns of neighbors when they haven’t done so before? What is going to be different about this process than other times when OSMP has asked for community input?
Others expressed disappointment that the original caucus meeting on September 15th was not adequately publicized to the community at large. They felt that OSMP did not give the community sufficient notification about the meeting nor did they convey its importance, which resulted in much less participation of the broader community who are not involved in specific conservation or recreation groups.
Once the concerns and issues about the process were aired, the meeting shifted to the original purpose: to get neighbor’s input on their concerns for the West TSA. The goal was to get ideas about what problems neighbors of Open Space encounter, what things neighbors would like to see changed and what ideas neighbors who live near Open Space might have to improve the trails and trailheads in their neighborhood.
Transcription of Giant Post-It Notes
Below are the “notes” that were taken at the meeting and posted on big white sticky sheets around the room. The “bolded” questions at the top of each sheet were meant as conversation starters. Attendees were also given smaller pads of sticky notes and could write down their ideas/suggestions, which are also included below.
Why did you choose to live west of Broadway?·
Proximity to Mesa Elementary·
View of the Flatirons·
Proximity to trailheads·
I decided to live west of Broadway to be close to nature and the conservation areas that preserve nature·
Being able to hike with my dogs off-leash·
Ability to walk to trailheads rather than drive
What benefits do you enjoy by living close to Open Space?- Local access for each neighborhood-
Good trail quality (must stay good)-
Being near solitude/peaceful retreat-
Knowing it’s there and protected (areas w/ no human access)-
Beauty- Access to great hiking-
Access to wild areas-
Wild life-
The great hiking trails
What drawbacks are there in living close to Open Space?-
Parking-
Trash-
Privacy-
Noise-
Damage to private property-
Trail braiding-
Noise after hours-
Dog waste-
Increased traffic / cars-
Bears & mountain lions (or is this a plus?)
What topics merit conversation and are unique to neighborhoods near Open Space?-
Sustainability: use of mountain bikes and their impact on trails, mountain biking is not compatible with other users (creates dust, street traffic, noise, etc)-
Parking needs increasing-
Garbage-
Invasion of privacy-
Noise-
Damage-
NIMBYism-
Too many restrictions means our Open Space is less welcoming-
Restrictions that close off access to open space from neighbor’s properties, loss of access to home owners near Open Space-
Creation of HCA’s equates to loss of access to trails-
There should be access for everyone NOT just for people who live adjacent to Open space-
Quality of the trails - Desire for loop trails & greater trail diversity-
We need thoughtful location of trailheads and diversity of trailheads-
Mountain bikes impair the solitary, peaceful experience of open space trail use-
More limited access-
The idea that Open Space can be a wilderness, and pristine is not reasonable or possible because OS backs right up to urban areas/people’s homes.-
Concerns about funding for any ideas that we come up with-
Need to have more trail connectivity.
What creative Open Space related ideas would make your neighborhood a nicer place to live for you and your neighbors?- Disperse trail users throughout the West TSA, ability to walk rather than drive to access trails (x 3)-
What should extent of access of mountain bikes? One idea: designated mountain bike trails-
Build a new mountain bike trail through Open Space that runs North to South [it is worth noting that this idea was put forth by someone who also voiced a strong opposition to mountain bikes in Open Space – sd]-
Plan for dog waste, dog latrines further back in OS, closer-in dog waste disposal supplied by OSMP-
For better trail connectivity OSMP needs to design trails that connect areas that users have shown are necessary by evidence of social trails. Use the social trails as an indicator of where we need better connectivity.-
Need bike racks @ trailheads-
Bus access to neighborhood trailheads- Have more neighborhood access points (that can only handle a low volume of users) eliminating car-parking problems, as they are meant to be accessed on foot/bike only. Trailheads that are specifically created for neighborhoods users.
More ways to reach out to neighbors to get their participation and input- Create flyers for handout-
Post flyers/updates @ Trailheads and Kiosks-
Avoid acronym soup-
Volunteer canvassers-
HOA distribution-
Via the newspapers-Daily Camera-
Chain Email-
Networks-
Obtain email lists from Colorado Div of Wildlife [sign-up list from meetings they held in the Newlands, Freelands]-
“Field Trip” Meetings-
More in-person meeting [geographic spread]-
Conversation starters onto blog to get comments-
Neighborhood email groups-
Mapleton contact: LSCHWEIGER@INDRA.COM
Transcription of individual notes written by attendees
Person A
Creative ideas: The WTSA is not a pie to be divided among interest groups. It is foremost a conservation area and we have a duty to protect it. So, let’s think about limiting access, not expanding it. Consider it a privilege to have the WTSA in Boulder.
Creative ideas: Preserve the WTSA as a nature preserve, with limited access only to low-impact use.
Creative ideas: I remember when there were mountain bikes in the WTSA. For walkers, it was terrifying. What would it be like 18 years later, now that the popularity of the sport has exploded?
Wildlife and HCA’s
I think that limited access to preserve open space and natural habitat is a good thing
Other topics.
Mountain bikes make natural areas less appealing to wildlife. We need to consider the impact of mountain bikes to wildlife.
Other topics. Bikers often drive to trailheads. There is no more room in Shanahan Ridge for parking near Open Space
Person B
Creative OS ideas
Reverse OSMP policies of “restrict, restrict, restrict”—welcome a diversity of user groups, income levels, and modes of transportation to the trailhead!
Creative OS ideas
Bike racks at trailheads (so many Boulderites can get to their hike by using a cruiser, not a car)
Person C
Other topics
- In areas open to mountain biking, other uses decreases. For instance, a recent survey of Dowdy Draw conducted since the trails were opened to biking showed that 87% of users now were bikers.
- Better use of trailside information. Boards for communication to neighbors/users
1. More detailed maps posted to include ALL trails/Access points in the immediate area of each Trailside Information Board.
Person D
- Need more trails
- Suggest diverting land acquisition dollars to trail building, access, impact mitigation and maintenance.
Person E
- An improvement would be to have dogs remain on leash at the beginning of the trails that pass by houses [situated] close to trails.
Person F
Dog Waste:
Need better plan for dog waste – possibly use the Envirowag system (created by Rose?)
- Encourage the use of biodegradable bags
- Dog Latrines
- Active pickup [of trash]
- Compost, high use areas
- Some $ from OS to do this
- Make it easier to clean up
Access:
- Map with locations to show neighborhood access points – to show, big, medium and local access points.
- Access w/out having to drive
- Don’t want to lose local access points
Neighbor participation in this CCG process:
- This a NIMBY issue, so how much weight should be given to the complainers that always show up and speak at neighborhood meetings like this.
- How to recognize the diverse number of opinions and what people are thinking - CCG Not a Democracy
- Hopefully some shade of everyone’s INDiViDual ideas will make it through
- Why just involve neighbors west of Broadway? Aren’t other neighbors relevant?
Improvements, suggestions & concerns:
- Loop trails in neighborhoods where possible
- Identify areas w/parking issues such as Chautauqua vs smaller areas where Neighbors think more parking issues are more likely to occur
Want to recognize public parking in high use / popular areas like Chautauqua or Eben Fine versus the number of small areas that are impacted, for whatever reason.
- OSMP management, what should it be? Disney Land Management or Rocky Mountain Park Experience or a personal local park experience
- Will Open Space have its budget funded to be able to implement whatever the outcome of this WTSA process?
Person G:
- Better use of Trailside Information Boards for communication to neighbors/users
1. More detailed maps posted to include ALL trails/Access points in the immediate area of the Trailhead Info board.
2. Communication of local cultural interest spots, natural wonders and/or conservation issues in the immediate area of each Trailhead Information board.
- Build trail from Mesa/Shadow Canyon/Big Blue area to Shirttail peak
Person H
- We want to be able to walk, rather than drive, with our dogs to trails from our home, so maintaining and expanding voice & sight areas near neighborhoods is important.
- Disperse users! We need more neighborhood access, not less. Walking or biking to neighborhood trailheads will be better for the environment, will reduce parking congestion and will reduce the impacts at the major trailheads (Sanitas, Shanahan Ridge, Chautauqua).
- To avoid issues with parking in neighborhoods, do not include neighborhood access points on trail maps. That way, the neighbors will be the primary users and will typically walk to the access point rather than drive.
- Require dogs to be leashed is the first 300 ft of trailheads. This is where most dogs do their business, so owners will be more likely to pick up their poo.
- Dog waste seems to be a big issue for everyone. Why not require all dog owners to carry poo bags?
Person I
- Negotiate a “trickle” of water year-round through normally dry ditches. Makes great riparian zone – good for all.
Thank you to CU grad student, Steve Konieczka, who transcribe these notes into a Word document and Shelley Dunbar who further clarified them.
